De-Bunking PvP Drops

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De-Bunking PvP Drops

Postby Lord Klotski » Fri Oct 17, 2008 7:10 pm

Similar to the thread on the Corporeal Beast , this thread aims to correct common mis-conceptions about the new PvP drop system.

1) Two people can kill one another indefinitely, with little risk, to acquire drops.

Wrong. After a certain threshold, drops turn to garbage:

If two players are killing each other, alternating kills and banking in between:

1 kill: Higher level player kills lower level player
2 kills: Lower level player kills higher level player
3 kills: Both players are skulled when lower level player kills higher level player. (May be more than three kills, but I'm pretty sure it's 3)


In general:

Similar to lootshare points, PvP points accumulate when you enter a hot zone (and less rapidly when you are in a non-hot zone). The points that you accumulate is proportional to your level. Items that you drop when you die on a PvP world contribute to this total. Spending time in a safe zone will reduce your PvP points. Drop tables are calculated according to your current points, and similar to lootshare points, reduce identically with the GE market value of the drops that you get.

2) Killing your friends in "Fake pking" is a fool-proof way of making money.

I have pked so far one whip and 2 zamorakian spears that belonged to people on my friends list while they were supposed to be killing me. *Tries to look innocent* :roll:

3) 1 iteming with a whip is enough to get drops, provided you are skulled.

Correct....unless you use protect item, and to be honest, you are. You must have 75k in your ITEMS DROPPED ON DEATH, and you will notice that if you activate the prayer and then look at your death tab, you won't be dropping the whip (and therefore do NOT have 75k in items...thus you won't get drops)

4) There is no way to get drops while 1-iteming (With, say, a whip or GS).

Sure there is! Turn *off* protect item just before you kill the person, then turn it on again. LOL. It's less dangerous than it sounds at 80+HP.

5) To get maximum rewards, you should carry 100k+ when dying to your friends.

Amusingly, I fell for this one too, on account of circumstantial evidence. The first time I killed someone with 100k, I got a Dharok Helm (sold it for 1.9M or so). Upon turning into my normal self again, I read the stuff that Jagex put out on it.... "Note that if you risk significantly more than 75,000 coins in items, your drops will not improve further, nor will they improve if your opponent loses 25 million coins' worth of items - the values are minimum boundaries. " - KB quote.

6) Bank after every kill when killing your friends.

"If you frequently enter safe zones, your drops will certainly not be as impressive as if you had spent the whole time in a hot zone." - KB quote. See above (q1) - it's a losing strategy

7) You can get drops even without having 75k in your inventory (on p2p)!!!1 zomg!

Sardines. Bones. Iron platebody. W00t.

8) You can get drops even without the other guy having 25k in HIS inventory!!1one. 0mf3gz?

Mithril platebody. Attack potion. Steel Scimitar. Hax.

9) Fast kills are good.

"If you kill more players in a short amount of time, the quality of your drops will go down."


EDIT:

Backing up the "Point system theory":

In general, the most important factors are the value of items you are risking, the amount your opponent drops and how long you have survived (ideally in a hot zone). A good tactic is to let your drop value build up by training in a hot zone for a while (which will be especially beneficial if you have some brawling gloves), then try to get a kill or two for a better chance of some good drops. Then you can go back to training to let your drop value increase again.




I will add to this list as time goes on.

(GF Ferarri, Doomedrusher - sorry about the "reverse PKs" LOL)
Last edited by Lord Klotski on Sun Oct 19, 2008 9:19 pm, edited 6 times in total.
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De-Bunking PvP Drops

Postby Boa1891 » Fri Oct 17, 2008 7:23 pm

"Note that if you risk significantly more than 75,000 coins in items, your drops will not improve further, nor will they improve if your opponent loses 25 million coins' worth of items - the values are minimum boundaries. " - KB quote.

I'd like to call BULLSHIT on Jagex.
It may not affect your generated drops, but you can always get your foe's items on death as long as you're risking the appropriate amount and you have a decent amount of "PvP points" (hotspot time, foe's level, etc).
Pantalaimone wrote:I think it is safe to say that Boa makes people quit. :lol: Boa is the anti joy of PKing :P

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De-Bunking PvP Drops

Postby Lord Klotski » Fri Oct 17, 2008 7:48 pm

Agreed, I noticed that usually on the last kill, people would be like..."hey I got geyser titan pouches lol."
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Postby Boa1891 » Fri Oct 17, 2008 7:53 pm

I got a circular hide and spined boots that were in my friend's inv when I got my first morrigan's top. (two now lmfao, other one in a real fight) He showed me his inv before the fight.
The whip I got was my foe's.
Pantalaimone wrote:I think it is safe to say that Boa makes people quit. :lol: Boa is the anti joy of PKing :P

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Postby Dragonlordjl » Fri Oct 17, 2008 8:27 pm

Boa1891 wrote:I got a circular hide and spined boots that were in my friend's inv when I got my first morrigan's top. (two now lmfao, other one in a real fight) He showed me his inv before the fight.
The whip I got was my foe's.


You must be the offspring of a Leprechaun. I truly loathe your luck. :evil:

On topic, there is very little reason to buy a "Corrupt item."

Corrupt items lack a special attack and their timer starts IMMEDIATELY upon equipping.

Regular items timers only start once used in combat. So basically:

Corrupt = 15 minutes
Regular = 60 minutes of COMBAT.

However, Corrupt are currently still a much better deal. For the money one normal Zuriel's Staff costs, you could buy 21 Corrupted Staves, totaling 5.25 hours of combat.
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De-Bunking PvP Drops

Postby Boa1891 » Fri Oct 17, 2008 8:47 pm

But no special, so what's the use of them? Regular combat, I guess.
HEY LET'S GO KILL ZAMMY WITH THIS SPEAR
OMFG WUTS DAT SPEER DO?
DISAPPEAR IN 15 MINS
LOL NOOB
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Postby Dragonlordjl » Fri Oct 17, 2008 8:50 pm

Boa1891 wrote:But no special, so what's the use of them? Regular combat, I guess.
HEY LET'S GO KILL ZAMMY WITH THIS SPEAR
OMFG WUTS DAT SPEER DO?
DISAPPEAR IN 15 MINS
LOL NOOB


Lol, I hate you for your luck but love you for your sense of humor :wink:
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Postby Skuzmeister » Sat Oct 18, 2008 12:39 am

Lord Klotski wrote:1) Two people can kill one another indefinitely, with little risk, to acquire drops.

Wrong. After a certain threshold, drops turn to garbage:

1 kill: Higher level player kills lower level player
2 kills: Lower level player kills higher level player
3 kills: Both players are skulled when lower level player kills higher level player. (May be more than three kills, but I'm pretty sure it's 3)


2) Killing your friends in "Fake pking" is a fool-proof way of making money.

I have pked so far one whip and 2 zamorakian spears that belonged to people on my friends list while they were supposed to be killing me. *Tries to look innocent* :roll:

Could you please elaborate on these two? I don't quite understand what you are saying here.
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Postby Inuashakent » Sat Oct 18, 2008 12:54 am

I got a DFS from PvP (No joke, bought an SGS. :D )

I'm not sure if this works, but shouldn't bringing a familiar raise your combat levels, thus resulting in higher loot for your partner?

And even if they're both skulled, does it really matter? Just hide somewhere and kill eachother. Run ~30 seconds or so from the bank. And secondly, two people won't get skulled (although I don't see why it matters...) because of the below tip...

And DO NOT take turns killing eachother. Do at least 3-5 first, because then you don't have to wait 5 minutes in the wilderness. (Or however long you choose to stay first.) Switch off in intervals higher than 1 to save time.
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Postby Lord Klotski » Sat Oct 18, 2008 1:37 am

@Skuzmeister: Wow , you lurk well LOL. Three posts in what, four months?

Basically, the first is a common complaint about the Pvp system. Specifically, the complaint states now that since the drop table is overpowered, it's far too easy to kill a friend over and over again in order to get free stuff.

Unfortunately, this is not strictly true. After a few kills (specified by the number on the little chart I made), the "drops" lower in value drastically (basically instead of getting rune, barrows, furys, etc, you got mithril stuff and the suchlike). At this point, you cannot continue to kill your friend and expect to make money...because you won't.

The second point was just me pointing out that, when I was the friend that was supposed to die, I killed the guy *that was supposed to be killing me* by accident. They were skulled...and subsequently lost their stuff.

@Inuashakent: Correct, bringing a familiar results in better kills for the other guy. Part of the reward is based on the difference between your combat level and the other guy's, so it makes sense for the loser to have as high a combat level as possible. Taking turns is insane , correct. I would recommend less than 5 kills - the drops tend to reduce to rubbish before then, but I have found that skulling both players seems to increase the amount of kills in a row that you can do before the drops turn to bunk. Usually I do this in fally...just hit some random guy in fally center then run off. Lol.
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Postby Inuashakent » Sat Oct 18, 2008 1:49 am

Your drops turn to junk because you're killing them too fast. You can stop and go do something else, and come back and kill them again. Or am I wrong, because Jagex tends to lie.
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Postby Skuzmeister » Sat Oct 18, 2008 3:34 am

Aha well actually I have been visiting this forum on and off since, hmm, it was before summoning came out anyway. I shall make a post later in the introduction thread I think.

Thanks for clarifying, it makes sense to me now and explains why I received a 150k drop followed by a 40k drop when killing my lower leveled friend. Problem here is we lost 75k a pop as we didn't know about the 25k limit for the person getting slaughtered.

And as for killing your friends Lord Klotski, why not turn off auto retaliate? :twisted:
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Postby Inuashakent » Sat Oct 18, 2008 3:36 am

Also, since I gained 15m from it, I've been getting bad drops since. I've even pked full rune and got... dds + rune full helm.
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Postby MotherBrainII » Sat Oct 18, 2008 4:28 am

Do we have any idea of drop rates for Brawling gloves or Zuriel's gear?
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Postby Ghost Phoenix » Sat Oct 18, 2008 9:29 am

Surely if you just get a group of people together and alternate kills so the drops will remain of decent quality? Or doesn't this work?

Edit:
Jagex wrote:* How many players you have killed on the PvP world recently (if you kill several players in a short amount of time, the quality of your drops will go down).

This would tie into drops becoming junk after a few kills. The thread I got this from doesn't mention anything about drops reducing if you kill the same person repeatedly so it's possible that they don't and we're just seeing the effects of killing too fast.
Therefore it is probably more effective to stand in a hot zone skilling and then kill your friend after 5 minutes or so.

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Postby Lord Klotski » Sat Oct 18, 2008 11:39 am

@Ghost Phoenix: Good point. Added to list. I do know that with two people, I still can get 2-3 kills of *both* of them before I start getting junk. This does, however, explain why Ekarderif barraging us all in deep wildy is somewhat counter productive.

@Skuzmeister: If your friend kept on killing you, over and over...sometimes you just dds him back. In the first case, it was a lucky high KO spec. In another case, I was messing around with a d spear spec and accidently KOed the guy.

@Motherbrain: For a variety of reasons (ie calculations that I haven't posted on this site) the accuracy in a drop rate for an item drops proportional to the square of its rarity. It can be showed using math that if you want to be accurate to 20% over a 95% CI (confidence interval), you need to accumulate approximately 50 of that item through independent sampling.

Dream on.

@Inuashakent: There is nothing magical about pking full rune anymore: as long as it's over 25k, the randomly generated drop is not affected.
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Postby Noxrid » Sun Oct 19, 2008 3:29 pm

Lord Klotski wrote:@Ghost Phoenix: Good point. Added to list. I do know that with two people, I still can get 2-3 kills of *both* of them before I start getting junk. This does, however, explain why Ekarderif barraging us all in deep wildy is somewhat counter productive.

@Skuzmeister: If your friend kept on killing you, over and over...sometimes you just dds him back. In the first case, it was a lucky high KO spec. In another case, I was messing around with a d spear spec and accidently KOed the guy.

@Motherbrain: For a variety of reasons (ie calculations that I haven't posted on this site) the accuracy in a drop rate for an item drops proportional to the square of its rarity. It can be showed using math that if you want to be accurate to 20% over a 95% CI (confidence interval), you need to accumulate approximately 50 of that item through independent sampling.

Dream on.

@Inuashakent: There is nothing magical about pking full rune anymore: as long as it's over 25k, the randomly generated drop is not affected.


Try letting someone die 2 or 3 times in a row before switching. :wink:

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Postby Boa1891 » Sun Oct 19, 2008 3:41 pm

1) Two people can kill one another indefinitely, with little risk, to acquire drops.

Wrong. After a certain threshold, drops turn to garbage:

1 kill: Higher level player kills lower level player
2 kills: Lower level player kills higher level player
3 kills: Both players are skulled when lower level player kills higher level player. (May be more than three kills, but I'm pretty sure it's 3)

BSBSBSBSBSBS

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10 kills off one person with less than 5 minutes between each one. Even on the last kill I made way more money than he lost, there was not a single drop that didn't double his 25K investment. 10th kill was the pick and skirt.
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De-Bunking PvP Drops

Postby Lord Klotski » Sun Oct 19, 2008 5:15 pm

Care to elaborate: Where you were killing, time spent in hotspot, combat levels of both involved parties , etc? Certainly from my testing today, this is not common....
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De-Bunking PvP Drops

Postby Boa1891 » Sun Oct 19, 2008 5:35 pm

I was at 123, he was pouched up to 133 for each kill. I was skulled, he was not. I had been sitting in varrock for about an hour before we started, and it took about half an hour to complete all the kills.
3.8M per 1.5hrs? Yesplz..!
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